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Instagram Caption Strategies: How To Find And Share Your Viewpoints

 

Ever taken an Instagram hiatus because you were tired of coming up with something witty and wonderful to say? Or maybe the 'stay-at-home' orders of pandemic life have got you wondering if there's anything interesting for you to share? If so, listen up! I'm joined by Megan Otto, my IG Strategist and Copywriter, to talk about how to find and share viewpoints, stories, and how to handle sharing them on Instagram in a way that supports your business (or your next launch).

 

 

We talked about...

  •  why people might hold back their viewpoints
  •  what happens when we try really hard to be professional
  •  being intentional about sharing your viewpoints on social media
  • why sharing viewpoints helps grow your community
  • distinguishing yourself as a business owner
  • educating versus entertaining content
  • why writing an Instagram post is like opening a present
  • what you can learn from clickbait headlines

Things mentioned in this episode

The Copywriter Club Think Tank

Megan Otto 

Megan's IG Brand Magic Method

Megan's free guide: How to Banish Content Fatigue... Forever! 

 

Learn more about Megan Otto

 Some people call her Megan Otto. But her friends call her badass, her kid calls her moooomm!!!!!, her ex calls her bitch, and she calls herself the Chief Wild Officer.

She wears all titles proudly.

When she’s not making her clients become unforgettable online, she’s probably swearing.

She’s freakishly obsessed with helping her clients find and unleash their signature blend of wild within that sets them free, sets them apart, and ultimately transforms their business from the inside out.

And she’s wickedly good at it.

F*ck.

 

Read the full transcript so you don't miss a thing


Sara: Today I'm welcoming Megan Otto. She's a chief wild officer who focuses on creative direction and brand strategy. And she helps her clients become unforgettable in line Oh, and something else but Megan, she likes to get a little bit swear. Before Megan tells us about herself, I'm going to channel some big Megan auto energy here and ask just thinking about what to write in Instagram, have you either a wind to throw up a middle finger B, ignore your own stuff and get lost in the scroll or see cringe because you wrote something that's okay. But it doesn't really capture what you think. Then keep listening because Megan is here today to talk about how to find and express your viewpoints on Instagram. So you can stand out calling your dream clients and get people ready to devour your next offer. 

Hey, Megan, thanks for joining us.

Megan: Hi, Sara. I love that little intro. I'm so excited to be here.

Sara: I'm so thrilled you're here. I cannot wait to talk about this, because I've already been working with you on all of this. And we're gonna get into that soon. But before we do first, go ahead and tell us all about you and your business.

Megan: Okay, yes. So I go by the Chief wild officer. So basically, I help women, entrepreneurs infuse more of their unique blend of their wild selves and every area of their online brand. So I believe that when women can get really clear on what makes them different, what's that sets them apart and really own their what you know what makes them different, and infuse it into their offers into their online brand experience. That is when the magic happens. And that is when they become set apart from everyone else. So I work with my clients and helping them with fun from Milan brand transformations to the visuals to planning out photoshoots. And yes, I absolutely love helping my clients with social media and showing up on Instagram because it is a very powerful tool for service based entrepreneurs musing

Sara: And how did you get started? or How did you decide to start focusing, let's say on this brand strategy piece and help people share their viewpoints? What made you choose that up against all the other guest areas that you could focus on with copywriting and brand strategy?

Megan: That is a good question. A couple of years ago, I had no clue what I wanted to do other than I wanted to have freedom, I want him to have an amazing, you know, dream life and do all these kinds of things. And so there was a lot of soul searching, there was definitely a lot of Google searching and I started in copywriting space and I really was drawn to communicating messages. I'm fascinated by how people communicate how you know, words can just change so many things about how we feel about ideas and how we relate to things and so I started doing copywriting and then I went down the rabbit hole a little bit and I really loved the strategy side of copywriting and really the foundation that everything is built off of so I kind of pivoted to doing brand strategy and creative direction kind of work and that was bad just like was amazing to me and I absolutely fell in love with all of that and then as I went down that trail a little bit more I realized for myself It made me like reflect on myself and how much I wanted to our I guess I was holding back and myself from like being my myself online. I was like oh my God, I've been this brand strategist and I kind of feel like I'm holding back parts of myself and I'm helping my clients like get clear on themselves but I realized how powerful it is to really not hold back and really let all of yourself show up in your online brand experience and not being inside this box. And so once I really leaned into that for myself as I was helping my clients do that it just that is the thing that lights me up the most is helping women really get clear on who they are what their viewpoints are and unleashing it in all parts of their online brand experience. And I really believe once you can let that part of you show up online it does change everything for yourself, the confidence you get and the business it really it really does transform your business.

Sara: I love that and I was thinking as you're as you're speaking here, even just in the time I've known you so I've known you for almost a year now that when I first met you and I went to your website and I checked it out I was like really drawn into your photos and in the way you wrote and you know just like the way you infuse your personality in with like the the fun photos, the chocolate cake things like that. But I've even noticed as you're saying like over the past year that your your brand was involved even more to become like talking about like this wild self and even like some of the swears and things like that. But I really love how when I look at your brand and like your messaging that I see that evolution and inspire Me and made it feel more possible for me, I know what to do more of the same, like how I can bring more of my whole self into my own branding and my own viewpoints and like not to hold that back. So I love that you're leaving that way. Thank you.

Megan: Oh, thank you for saying that. And that is something that I was, yeah, it, you know, you kind of when you know, inside, if you're holding back, you can kind of feel it within you. And it's like, there was this feeling within me. And it's like, I'm, I'm putting myself out there. But I know that there is more, you know, to let through. And so thank you for that feedback, because it does feel really good to know that I can inspire women to do more of that for themselves. Like that is what lights me up like nothing else.

Sara: Yeah. Why do you think people do hold back? I know, I know, veering off a little bit here. But I think it's it's important, right? Because we do do that. And I know, I find like when I work with people on their copy, oftentimes they're like, over professionalizing it right? Like the way they're speaking. And they're kind of writing how they were taught in school, or they're, they're really feeling they have to be the certain person a certain persona in order to be like, I'm a very professional business where and you know, like, once we start relaxing that and you know, changes in the rules, depending on who of course they want to work with and speak to, it just becomes like they get they light up people get called in more is what I think that like, what do you think why? Why do they? Why do we do that to ourselves?

Megan: That is such a fascinating question. And one, it's one that I could talk on and on about and I think you hit on several points. I think it's, I think it's a multi layered question with multi layered answers. And I think part of it is just traditionally the business world has been very buttoned up and professional. And so there's just a lot of that infused into our understanding, but how we come to the business world, right, as we're starting out as entrepreneurs, we want to be really professional. And so we try really, really hard to be taken seriously. And so we're afraid to be too casual, right be let our personality show too much for being afraid that you know, we're not going to be taken seriously. So there's that part of like the quote, unquote, buttoned up professional world that plays into it. And then it's also scary to be yourself and be judged for being yourself, right, just from not even a business standpoint, as human beings. When we meet somebody for the first time, we always show up with layers and filters. And we're never usually we're never just like our full on selves. Like when we're at home, when nobody's around. And we're just chilling, we're living our best life. That's usually not what we bring to the table when we meet someone for the first time, because we don't know what they're gonna think. So it's kind of like this, almost like a defense mechanism. We're protecting ourselves. And so there's that layered on top of all of the professionalism. And so we were very, usually very guarded. And we try and really control how people think about us. But what ends up happening is we do show up as this very, like, boxed in filtered version of ourselves, which can work and we can build businesses off of that. But that's, you know, not the best way to go about it for multiple reasons. But yeah, I think it's it comes down to those, those kinds of reasons where we just we are we're afraid of being judged. And the third thing I would say is that we are so close to ourselves, that it's really hard to get that objective, you know, how people see us, and we're not, we're not always sure how we're coming across, right, we might think that we're being really open, we might think that we're coming across one way, when the person on the other side of the screen is getting a whole different, you know, experience of us. So there's those kind of three main things I would say that come into play.

Sara: I love that the way you explain that, and I think I'm going to jump into that last point a little bit is that I think that when like, we don't always recognize like our own brilliance, right, our own genius, we think like, Oh, it's just like, it's so easy for me, or I just know that and it's not a big deal. But when someone can like reflect it back to us, or can be that person, which you know, you were for me in our session, again, we'll talk about that a bit. But how many of you hold up that mirror to the viewpoint? You're like, Oh, do you say those things and like, those are smart. more of those that we don't just discount that or and realize that people like, do you want to hear that, and they come to us for that. But it's hard to find that, you know, recognize that for ourselves. I know, you know, a few iterations of my business ago, I used to write social media strategy and that's one of the things we would do at the end of it was actually talk about having responses ready for when people if they did judge you or write something negative because there was that fear.

Like, what if I say this, some people get pissed off? Like, how am I supposed to respond? So we'd actually have like, a couple a couple responses just ready to go for when something would happen because like, if you are sharing your viewpoint, it's gonna happen you know, at some point or other someone's gonna respond back or push back a little bit. It might not be like super mean about you, but it might make you know, feel a little uncomfortable, aggressive, so like, I think having some of those things ready to go might help. I don't know what do you think of it that.

Megan: yeah, that's another one and that it is it's that fear of being judged and people just being like, Oh my god, you're crazy. So that is that's a lot there. I think there's a lot of like, inner mindset work that just like has to, you just have to face as a business owner right to put yourself out there. It's scary to do that. Because, you know, you could fail people can judge you if people can Think you too much, you can be afraid of being canceled, like, all of the things can come up. And so I think that for all of us, like, we have to, like, deal with that, like, I know for me like there's always things that I have to deal with as a business owner for putting myself out there.

It's it's not the quote unquote, easy path always. And so specifically, if you're sharing your viewpoints on social media, like I think it's just you have to be really aware, I always say like being intentional is just is so important for us as business owners. And so like being intentional and being like, Okay, I'm gonna put this out there. If this happens, how am I going? What am I going to feel about it? Like, just like, you're like, kind of like having that plan of attack for yourself? It's not like, I think it's smart to have like, like, you're saying, like, think through what to say to people, but also like, Think for yourself, like, what are you going to? How are you going to react? How are you going to feel and think through that before you do something?

Because once you put it out there, it's out there. But I think that like taking that preventative maintenance, and really thinking through, like, Can I handle the worst case scenario of this, you know, whatever harsh feedback could come from it, and just trying to prepare for it and sitting with it before, you know, starting to put yourself out there.

Sara: And so that's perfect to go into the next question I had for you. So you talk on your website about standing out like a flamingo in a sea of zebras. That means putting our viewpoints out there, right. It's part of that. So how can we start doing that? And why is it so important? Why is it worth let's say, this risk that we've been talking about? Yes.

Megan: Love this question. Love this topic, so much. So our viewpoints are what distinguishes us, right? They're part of us. So we have the core essence of us, right is, is what sets us apart from everybody else. And how we express that is one of the ways is through our viewpoints. And so if we're not sharing what we actually truly believe, as bold, opinionated viewpoints, we are, we're losing out on the ability and the chance to start being leaders start growing a community because if you want to grow community, you have to give your people something to latch on to right. So if you're not sharing anything noteworthy, or quote, unquote, controversial, nobody's ever gonna be able to latch on to anything.

If you're just like sharing like, you know, safe facts or like tips and tricks for your business, that's great. But it's not going to set you apart and make people look up to you. And really consider and ponder what you're saying, right? So viewpoints are one of the best ways to distinguish yourself and make a nickname for yourself, right? And so how can we how can we start doing that? So I guess on the minute boils down to it, it's really just getting clear and reflecting on what you really believe. And I think the biggest thing with this is really just be the ability to tune out everything out there. And really just be okay with owning what you believe.

Because there's always going to be that voice in there is that's like, either like, Oh, it's already been said before, or, oh, who am I to say this? Or, oh, I don't have enough experience to back this up, right? Those things are always going to be there. But I will just say this on the front end, like literally every single guru out there. There's another guru out there that contradicts what, you know, the first one says, right, everything on the internet is debated. So he might as well go out there and say what you're gonna say, because there's, there's no reason not to, but it really comes down to just being okay with being uncomfortable at first and just tuning out tuning out the noise and going inwards instead of outwards.

Sara: I love that you said that. And I think as you were talking about people who tend to latch on to I think often about like the businesses who took the ones like even like I aspire to be right like I there's like, where are they you know, where there's, I think you can get to like a certain level maybe you're saying without like having like those few points you can like you're doing good work and does and you know, you're doing good work and people hear about you.

But then I feel like there's like this something that happens with like the scaling like something like this rocket feeling are skyrocketing. When you start having this viewpoints. That's when you start like building that community and really people getting to know you. And I feel like the your business trajectory really changes once that happens.

Megan: I completely agree. And that's a really good point. I'm glad you said that. If you look at every single, you know, thought leader, Guru, whatever you want to call them, you can bet anything, they all have strong, unapologetic viewpoints. So when I say unapologetic, that doesn't mean that they I'm sure that they still have times when they struggle with same stuff. And we're all humans, but they do it anyways. Because they actually they truly do believe what they're saying. But they all do and it does it changes the trajectory of your business and how people view them. hugely important.

Sara: Recently, I work with you on an Instagram brand magic session where you started off helping me identify my viewpoints. And before we get into why we did that, tell me first What do you see a lot of business owners doing an ID these days in terms of their captions.

Megan: There is a lot of people wanting to give value value value, right like their whatever their niche, whatever it is. Notice that they have. And so they focus a lot on the value part. And like educating with tips and tricks, which isn't bad. Like I don't, I don't disagree with doing that there's ways to do it really well and really effectively. But I think that that's something that I see a lot of is people are always trying to educate. And the other thing, there's a lot of upfront selling that goes on, which I have viewpoints on that too.

Sara: Tell me your viewpoint in selling.

Megan: Okay, so my, I guess I'll back it up with I think your viewpoints, you should leave with your viewpoints in business. And so this is just what you think. So as business owners, we if we want to distinguish ourselves, we have to be willing to share our thoughts on a lot of different things. And if you again, going back to examples of, you know, thought leaders, if you look at them, whatever their money making generation, you know, offers are, they're talking about shit, that's way outside of that they are like, this is how you do business, this is how you do life, this is how you scale your business. This is how you time management, right?

They're talking about all of it. And as human beings, we are dynamic, amazing human beings with so much insight that we all bring to the table. And if we're just diminishing our insight and, you know, opinions to this one little sliver and slice that is just limiting ourselves to how people can connect with us and latch on to us. So the first thing is you really want to open up and not just be selling all the time, because that gets old, right? Nobody really likes to be sold or educated. But everybody likes to be entertained. And you know, these viewpoints can be polarizing, and in a way entertaining, right? It's interesting to see what people thinks about the opposite of selling all the time, is that you should be just sharing your viewpoints.

That's what people connect with. It's easy to comment on somebody's viewpoint. But if somebody's selling all the time, like it's not as easy to engage with that, right. So I'm not saying that you shouldn't sell I think that you should absolutely, I think that you should also absolutely educate your audience on what your offers are. But you should also sprinkle in really great stories a as you're selling them, and be you dealing with your viewpoints, because that is what people latch on to that is what people can have an opinion on. And that is what is most interesting to people. So that's kind of what I think about that. 

Sara: I like how you went into, like, he came back and told us it's okay to sell. But we need to, you know, there's a place for it, essentially. And that's something you brought up around that there's a lot of like that how to type of content, and I come across it when I'm like writing with my clients as well. There's that natural tendency to just like want to teach or give a strategy. And I'm always trying to pull back say like, let's like talk more about that that shifting perspective. Like, what do we need people start, like understanding or believing around this topic, as opposed to just like, like more stuff how to do because we all have a lot of stuff to do just kind of show me why it matters.

And I think it sounds like you're saying that like, that's good. we're on the right track with that. sharing those viewpoints and talking. So let's jump into what makes Instagram posts effective. Like are there certain parts of you see, they all should have ones that really pop? Tell us
about that? 

Megan: Yes. Okay. So my favorite way to explain like the best kind of Instagram post is to think of it like you're giving a present to your best friend, okay. So if your best friend has a special event coming out, maybe it's their birthday or something, you're giving them a present, you're going to go pick something out for them, right, it's going to be really awesome, you're going to make it about them, there's going to be like perfectly customized to your best friend. But you're not just going to give it to them most likely as the whatever it is, you're going to wrap it up, right. So you have this gift and you wrap it up. And that's the first thing right? When you're getting a present, and you see it coming and it's all wrapped up. It's exciting, right? It entices you in if you saw something on a table that's unwrapped, versus wrapped, like you're gonna gravitate more towards the present, it looks all pretty and thoughtful and exciting, right? So that's how I like to think about Instagram posts. So you want to you want to have a great gift, which is the content itself, right?

But how do you get people enticed and excited about it, and that is the wrapping paper. That's how you wrap it up and package it, which is the headline, and then either the graphic or the image that goes with it. So that's the simplest way think about you're giving a gift to people. So let's talk about like the actual present itself first. So yes, you want to have it you want to make it entertaining, and memorable. So maybe we can talk about this in a minute. So I either say you have a sexy story that you're wrapping up you're educating or selling topics into or you're leading with these voracious viewpoints, right, you make it memorable, you make it entertaining headlines are just so critical.

Because on Instagram, you're not going to actually read and click into anything unless something makes you do it right. So having a really enticing, short, snappy headline that creates this open loop hooks you in is super important as well as the image the more that you can match the headline to the image. I call this the brand magic effect when you match them together and they're both communicating the same feeling super powerful, as well as having great quotables are graphics. Those are great for Instagram as well.

If it's a really great text quote that you can just make a graphic but that is the short, quick, easy version of how to make great Instagram posts can use Tell the listeners a little bit more about what you mean by open loop headline what that is? Yes, good question. So the open loop headline is where you start telling you're leading into something that comes next. So that an example of this could be like, Oh my god, today I saw that dot dot. And that's all it is. So they're like, if you read that you're like, what did you see? You don't tell them, you start to get them excited about what is coming next. But you don't actually give them everything. So it's kind of like enticing somebody. And so open loops are super powerful, because as human beings, we're naturally curious, and you want to know more. So it's all leading them to click in here.

Sara: Are there any other types of headlines like how can we how else can we think about writing headlines? You're saying there's an open loop? Is there any other sort of, like, let's say formulas or things that people can think about when they're writing one?

Megan: Yeah, I like to say keep your headline, like, make it as short as possible. If you can condense what you're saying into like, a couple of words. That's, that's the goal that you're going for. So short, snappy, and I like to make it as polarizing as possible. So I like clickbait as a way to think about it. So clickbait gets a bad rap, because what comes after it is false and misleading, right? That's obviously shitty. You shouldn't be misleading your audience ever. But clickbait in and of itself is just great marketing, right? If you get somebody to click, that means you're doing a good job because you're wanting them to see what you're talking about. So how can you make your headlines exciting and clickable. So don't try and just like have a paragraph like your first paragraph should never be like the start of your caption or your headline, it should be something that stands alone, and is it literally stands alone from the rest of your text, but it's it leads into the full caption.

Sara: Perfect. Okay, so let's jump back to the session I booked with you in February. It was an ID red magic session. And I remember when you gave me the homework denta phi, my viewpoints I felt pretty stuck. At first, it's a cheating email, like, I think I need more time. So I wasn't sure like, what do I even say, you know, do I even have you points like if I want to share them, and although I knew I had them, I think there's that there was that introvert side of me was like, I'm uncomfortable here, basically putting myself out there. And so it's the same thing I see when I'm working on coffee with my clients I've already mentioned, and it's much easier for me to reflect back to them the viewpoints. So I want to know, like, why do you think people maybe have difficulty in identifying their own viewpoints?

Megan: Yeah, this is such a great question. Because it does affect everyone equally, when we're trying to reflect inwards because it kind of is that whole thing with like, we're so close to ourselves, we don't we like suddenly forget that we're these brilliant, magnificent human beings that has, you know, an amazing any amazing thoughts at all to put out and we put pressure on ourselves right to to, like, say it perfectly say really good things, we are afraid also of what other people are thinking about us. And so there's all these little things going on in the background.

A lot of times, they're kind of like subconsciously, we're not even like fully like articulating them that to ourselves. And we're just kind of like, just make things out muddled up and confusing. But I think that's, that's what it is. It's just, it's hard. And again, it's just it's so hard to get that clarity on ourselves. Because we are so close to ourselves. That's why I love when you have somebody else that can hold that mirror up for you and like help reflect back out it just, it's amazing. Then you see like, Oh my god, like I have, I'm like, I'm just this amazing and brilliant human being. And it is so helpful and powerful to start that process.

Sara: Can you tell us a little bit more about how we can start to nail our viewpoints down on our own? Maybe even thinking back to some of the process that you had me do? If you want to explain that? Or can break it down a little bit for us?

Megan: Yes, absolutely. My favorite thing to do is to have a couple of journal prompts. And to just brainstorm I'm a huge advocate of journaling and brainstorming setting aside like, I don't know, you know, doesn't have to be crazy long, you need 2030 minutes. And then having a couple of journal prompts, which I do have a freebie that everybody can go through with these journal prompts that are awesome for helping you get your viewpoints fleshed out. But it is it's about being intentional. And it forces you there's these questions that you ask yourself, like, what do you think about this? What in my industry needs to change?

You know, what do I believe about x, right? And so you ask yourself these questions. And you'll be amazed when you start to be intentional. And you have this pocket of time that you have to brainstorming and you just like let the pressure off. You just flow and you don't edit yourself. And that's the best way to start being intentional. And you'll start to get these things on paper and you'll be like, oh, wow, like I do have some pretty cool opinions about this stuff. But that's definitely the best place that I recommend starting.

Sara: I really love that. Are there anything else that we can do like any other things, like looking through our content or onboarding forums or anything or any other places that we can sort of dig into if we're like staring at that journal and feeling blank? Like Where can we go for some more inspiration.

Megan: Another idea that you can do is you can have a friend be like, Hey, can you just ask me like some questions to like, just be like, ask me what I think about, you know, you can even have these like these couple journal prompts or whatever and have them ask them to you, because talking about things out loud, and somebody and getting feedback from another person is a really great way to get insight about what you believe, right. So that's a good thing that you can do. It doesn't even have to be like a business friend, you can just have like anybody, it's just like a human being like in that space, it just really helps go back and look at past content, see the opinions that you had the capacity emails, and just let it like, try and like shut out the noise, shut out what other people are doing and just they really start getting deeper into why you believe that? Like, just ask yourself why that's pretty much the best question you can ever ask yourself. Just keep asking why, why why, right. And just keep drilling deeper and deeper into what you actually believe about the things that you've posted before and start questioning that. And that should give you some more insight.

Sara: Yeah, I really found that in our session that was so helpful. Like I went through those journal prompts, and some of them answered more than others. But then during our time together, you really like push me in a gentle but good way, gentlemen, like let's do it. To get down to those viewpoints. And I think when I when I reflected back on them afterwards, there were things that like definitely, I had, like kept in my head that I think that I probably should have clients in conversations or, or come out in like copywriter things I'm doing but I wasn't expressing, like even just talking about my opinions on like payment plans and launching, right, or I think I had some other ones around false scarcity or like why listening is so important.

And just like, there's several other ones as well. But it was so great having that time with you. Because I don't think I would have like, listened them out so much before and now that I have them like not only can I use them for Instagram, but also like podcasts or other content or like even thinking is actually helped me looking at creating the framework and like tightening up my framework for my the way I do things as well.

So I think these viewpoints I mean, come up with them, they can be used for so much. And there's something about having them to where you're like when you can look at them. And for myself, at least I like look at the list we came up with and I'm like, Yeah, like I noticed. And even though I know that I did, like I've been doing this for a long time, I have lots of proof that I'm seeing it on paper. And like really looking at these opinions and these things that you do like you're really just like solidifies for you to increase it, I think and that was a really powerful takeaway from our time together that I didn't expect.

Megan: Yes, there what you're saying, Yes, that's it, like having, you know, we do discredit ourselves and or we don't give ourselves enough credit. And the confidence that comes from seeing everything crystal clear on paper is like, wow, I do know stuff. And like it does like everything that we're saying that you have so many amazing viewpoints. And it just makes me so excited for you to be expressing them and talking about them. And yes, you can use them in your podcasts, you can use them and emails and all these things. Because again, that's what sets you apart, right? Are these amazing viewpoints and they should be expressed across your brand experience.

Sara: And I even found it like recently I was doing some, you know, pitching myself to podcasts and even like speaking other groups, and again, having those viewpoints like it's so much easier, like oh, this would be like a perfect topic for this. Like I can talk about this or, or like weaving those things into presentations are so much more powerful. And I have noticed that that is exactly what I'm let's say I just recently did a presentation in someone's mastermind around like irresistible sales pages and some of those viewpoints that I shared within that like embed in there. That's what people latch on to. Those are the questions that they're dming me about afterwards. Those ones are like Hold up, pause, like let's talk about that. Because they were beyond the how to write they were very specific to me. And I'm struggling with that. And it's just it's really illuminating. And it's a really good reminder about like, why we need to nail those down.

Megan: Yes, I for everything you just said I completely agree.

Sara: If we were live, we could high five. Of course if it wasn't like pandemic because we also can't talk. Today's episode is brought to you by the launch playbook club. It's a place for service based business owners who want to launch a course membership or group offer and are tired of trying to figure out all on their own with weekly copy critiques and strategy calls for personal feedback, access to tech roadblock busting q&a sessions, monthly training around six figure launch strategies and templates for all your launch copy needs. The launch playbook club is your roadmap to accelerate the success of your next launch without burning out become a member of the launch playbook club at www dot Sara vartanian.com slash launch dash playbook. So once we have these viewpoints, how can we share them with folks without feeling like we're being all like shouty or preaching or does that even matter helis.

Megan: Okay, great question. Some people might get mad at me for saying this, but you got to be preachy with your viewpoints. Now you don't have to be obnoxious with your viewpoints but viewpoints by themselves. are controversial. They are what you believe, because that's what you believe, right? There's not like you have this like manifesto backing up, like scientific data that are netted out, right? Like these are your personal viewpoints like yes, you have reasons why you believe them. But you don't have to explain yourself to everyone, right, your viewpoints stand alone.

And so that feels scary, right? Because when you're educating somebody, or you're sharing tips and tricks, that's more like backed up by you know, methods, usually things that we've learned personal experience, or whatever viewpoints are a little bit different, they're a little bit in a different category, there's not this safety net of having like things backed up. So I do say, I do recommend, you know, being reflect on what you think you can or cannot handle.

Like, if you put something out there, that's super controversial. And you know, that it might cause like this huge, you know, backlash or whiplash, you have to be prepared for what that can do to you. So don't do things that you are extremely uncomfortable with. I think that good viewpoints like anything in business, anything we do in life, you know, there's things that are absolutely going to make us uncomfortable. And that doesn't mean we shouldn't let that stop us. Right? We should do things that are uncomfortable within reason. So yes, viewpoints are probably going to make you a little bit uncomfortable. It's, I totally go through that. But every single time I do, like you were saying, Sarah, it's the people.

That's what they latch on to. That's what people talk to me about. And so it is a practice as well. And that's something that I think I know, half I have to remind myself with as well is that we can practice this stuff, it doesn't have to It's not wrong, if it feels uncomfortable right away. That doesn't mean we're doing it wrong, it actually will get easier, the more you do it, but sometimes you have to go through that uncomfortable Growing Pains phase. But again, you know, listen to yourself, trust your intuition and know the difference between like the whiplash that you can handle and can't handle. And I will say this, that this is me to all of you, if you have new points, I support you saying them, I think that you should say them, I think that it's okay to get on your soapbox. That's really what you believe. You got to let it out. And I'm cheering you on.

Sara: So what if Okay, so it looks like we have a viewpoint today. And we put it out there. And then you know, we learned something different. So I wouldn't think about a lot of what's been happening in you know, the past six or seven months, lots people have been focusing on on learning, you know, racist behaviors like and also like re looking at it as a copywriter. I'm looking at language a lot, right? Like, how am I using language? Or is like, are we building these equity pieces? Like, is this language hurting people? So there's lots of unlearning taking place across all of our industries and personally in our lives. So what if we share something today? It doesn't have to be related to like, you know, inclusion and racism and race and all that. But still, like, that's what's coming to mind right now, what's been happening a lot, but like, what if we share something today? And then six months we learn or believe something different? What happens? Can our viewpoints change that, like, how does that make us? Look? Tell me what you think about that? 

Megan: Oh, my God, Sarah, this is such a good question. I'm so glad you asked this, because this is actually something I do believe we all get in our own way with it's like, oh, yes, that hits the nail on the head. If I change my mind, does that make me a fraud? Does that make me look dumb? Or people that kind of take me seriously? So glad you asked this, okay, so a couple of things. Number one, as human beings, we're always going to be evolving, right? Five years from now, you are going to have so much more knowledge, so much more life experience, that you should be evolved, you should have new insights to share, right? And so a lot of times what that looks like is it's an evolution of what you already believes.

So it's not like it necessarily is like, radically shifted, but like, maybe you have more insight now that you can be sharing, you know, five months, five years from now, and that's fine. So I think it's the first thing is to remember, like, as human beings, it's good to evolve, we should shift and change, growth is good. That's the first thing. The second thing is if you find that you have this viewpoint that you've been preaching about, or whatever, and then you suddenly for whatever reason, you have this new epiphany, this new insight, and you find that it's changed, I would say just like, accept yourself and be like, Okay, great, that's good. I'm glad you know, this happened, try and like put it in that lens and know that, hey, if you hadn't if you just been living in fear, and not putting out any viewpoints at all, for fear of this happening, what are you doing to yourself, you never, you know, you might never have this happen, or it could happen. But if you're holding back out of fear, all you're doing is universally holding yourself back. If you do have these viewpoints that do come up, I do believe it's going to actually like shift you and grow you and change you even more to go through something like this.

Even though it seems like scary. Don't say that it that's what's going to happen. But it's okay. And you can say and use it as a teaching experience with your audience and be like, Hey, this is what I learned. This is why I think something differently and the right people are going to respect you even more for that. And that's what I believe about that. Now I know it's easier said than done to say all of these things. But just remember, if you're holding yourself back for fear of, let's say you have, you know, 100 viewpoints, and five of them, you have to recount on think about, you know, if you held all of those back, like, that's just that doesn't make sense to do that.

Sara: You know, as you're saying about taking your audience on that journey with you like sharing, like, Hey, you know, this is what I used to believe. But actually, now I believe this because I think it is so powerful. And I know like when I'm following, like we talked about, like those other thought leaders and experts and think people that I look up to, I respect them for that, even if it's like, I respect them, one for actually being willing to get uncomfortable and kind of messy in front of me or front of like me, the world because I know that's like brave, right?

And a little scary, so I respect the heck out of that. But also, like, I appreciate that they are then now challenging me to rethink about something as well. And so often sometimes, like, I'll still, you know, come along on that viewpoint, I might read something else about it, or at least, even if I don't, you know, takes me a while to like buy into it. Or even if I don't agree, like, they've given me another way to look at it, which I think is just, I love it, like having no different perspective. I think that is like makes life so interesting. But also it helps us learn, right, like it helps us be willing to move along. So and I think our audiences will feel the same to a lot of people.

Yeah. Okay, so you talk, you know, we talked a lot about the viewpoints, that you have the sort of neat formula for combining viewpoints with stories. I mean, a stories are important part also of sharing things on Instagram and online. So can we talk about the role stories playing and how we can work them in with our viewpoints?

Megan: Yes, absolutely. So when it comes to your content that you're putting out, I really think that you only have to have these two main buckets, you can have these what I like to call sexy stories, and then your voracious viewpoints. So when you are educating and selling your audience, things which you should be doing, and totally not saying you shouldn't I think that obviously leading with your viewpoints is smart. But when you are educating and selling to your audience, if you're just doing that as a standalone method of doing it, it's going to be harder to get people interested and engaged. So you bring a story into it, which let me just raise my hand virtually here and say, like, I didn't use to understand what people meant when they're like, Oh, just like salad stories. I'm like, What stories are you talking about? Like, what do you even mean, right? All a story is, is something that happened in your personal life that you can relate to and segue into this, you know, educational topic, or the selling point. So like, I went to the store today, and I ran into an old friend, and we started talking about something, something something and somehow you wrap it into you segue into, you know, this topic point, that's all it is, it's taking something happen in your personal life and tying it in and the reason why that's so powerful is because as human beings again, we're very curious. And we are all about knowing other people's lives, right? Reality TV shows wouldn't be so popular if that wasn't the case.

So it's like giving people this like little mini dose of like reality TV like think about it that way you can you can have like really like what we think is like we always think we all I don't have this interesting life. Yeah, actually like going to the grocery store, running out of like toilet paper, like there was no toilet paper at this point, right? Those those are little, these little tiny things that are we have so many things that happen in our daily life that we can use. So that is that's all it is. It's super simple. And I hope that if like the thought of like telling you a story, or leading with stories has been confusing, I hope that like helps make it easier for you to relate about and think about how many little things in your life that you can segue into a news and then with voracious viewpoints. These are these like beliefs that you have. And the good news is, is they're already literally within you. You don't have to do any work. All you have to do is extract them, but they're already within you. So those are the two buckets to pull from.

Sara: Perfect. And I thought it might be fun if I shared a couple of those stories that you helped me come up with, just to really show really is about like a freaking life. I know I showed you with that too. I was like Megan, you know, the pandemic is on I work from home I took anywhere. Like what am I gonna talk about for stories. So we came up with a couple and I'll share two of them. So one, I had told Megan that for the holidays, we had bought our boys I have two boys 911 they were getting you know, they're getting taller and bigger. And I bought them double. We bought them a little bit. And so I was looking for organic sheets for them. I was really making how I spent like way too many hours roaming the internet around like organic sheets and I could not make a decision and I don't know why I was so stuck on it. I really couldn't. But then when we got down to it, it reminded me of how like some of the clients I have really can't decide between let's say like kajabi or think if ik or like ConvertKit or Active Campaign and they spent so many hours on this decision when it's like just make one and move on because then you'll have time your energy will go back to like what you really need to focus on because really once you know your budget like that helps you really rein in your decision. So know your budget. Go read the pros and cons and decide and So we, you know, tide me looking for organic sheets and like this like Google scroll, massive list like, my husband's like,

Can we stop talking about sheets here into, you know, raining that back into like an experience I had with my clients and then the other one make and I talked and I talked about was so you know, I got like, like a lot of the world hooked on the whole britischen series on Netflix and then I took it a step further and went and you know, read the entire series because I read a lot for the entire series over a few weeks. And I told Megan I was like I love because when you read the books, the author has actually done this like second epilogue because like, you know, when you've finished a story you always want to know, like about later you're like, Oh, just tell me more about afterwards. Like how did it work out?

And she does that she has a second epilogue and she talks about how she created a second a second epilogue because she had so many like readers writing and being like, what happened. Like, I want to know how their life turned out. So she actually created this like, additional book with the second epilogue, which she then later on, I guess when they republish, they put them into like each original book and I loved it so much was so satisfying to read, like what happened 10 years down the road with these people, but then I was able to tie it back to the whole you know, viewpoint I have that we need to listen to our audience and like spend the time listening to them because it actually helps us create something that they just like can't get enough of and like draws them in irresistible. And that is what this like bridge written offer author did. So I was able to tie in my like binge reading, binge watching in to my viewpoints. And I thought those are two sort of fun stories that we talked about.

Megan: Yes, I love it. And it's so perfect. It's just everyday life and it has the most perfect tie in and like when I like if I'm reading this on Instagram, I was like, Oh yeah, I want to know about Sarah's like what she's watching on Instagram. Oh, she's buying organic. I mean, like, what's, what's going on there? It's interesting. It's perfect.

Sara: I think and like, I guess also to like a good reminder, like, we're all doing stuff like that, too. Like too much online shopping. I mean, we're home especially right now these days, right. But it was such a great reminder to me to like, even though it might feel like things are really boring, or things aren't really going on, there's like little there are little things happening that I can share and that people like again, like I just want I want to know what you're doing. What are you buying? What are you watching? What are you doing in your life and tying it in? Okay, so a lot of my copy clients and members of the launch playbook club, they want a better use Instagram as part of their pre launch strategy. So like before they launch you know, something officially let's whether it's a chorus membership, or a new, let's say service, how can sharing and knowing their viewpoints, help them in that pre launch period to get people ready to purchase your offer? And why is it important to really make sure they're pulling those in ahead of a launch.

Megan: when you are universally expressing your viewpoints people, you every time you do this, you're elevating yourself as a thought leader or a leader, and people are looking up to you and they're able to latch on to you again. So that's the whole purpose of this. And so when you're launching, you know, you want people to pay attention to you and listen to what you're doing. And so this might be kind of just like a basic answer. But by doing this all the time, it's not like your audience your con. It's like you're constantly building this audience and you're constantly like priming for this launch, right? There's no like, on and off, right? Like we all like see people online where it's like holy shit, like they're in launch mode, it's like all of a sudden they're just like all over the place right? When you do this, it's like this gradual you know pathway and you're taking people on this journey and it doesn't feel abrupt and that is so powerful because again, you want people to latch on to you and and build this community of people that are engaged and I really believe sharing your viewpoints and being unapologetically you is the absolute best way to do that. So it's like it's a basic answer, but it's kind of like always priming for that there's no abruptness on this on this pathway to launching when you're actually in launch mode.

Sara: I like that so much I feel like that's so much you know like so much less stressful launches would be if we were just doing that priming all along right that we weren't actually like not only do we have to come up with the launch content we also have to do like all the like now I have to wait you know four weeks of Instagram no you're already doing that you're already been talking about this all along. I think that's just like it makes it a good case for why we want to like build in our viewpoints and tell our stories all the time. So Megan, thank you so much for joining us say and digging into Instagram stories and viewpoints and why we should share ours where can we find out more about you share with us all the goodies and the place at the spa? 

Megan: Yes, well first of all, thank you for having me. This is so much fun. I absolutely love getting to talk about this with you and your audience. And yes so you can I absolutely love to hang out on Instagram my handle is add to the Megan Otto My website is Megan dash Otto calm and I do have a guide that you can download that just really helps you walk through and gives you prompts for fleshing out your viewpoints. It gives you it helps you get your sexy stories figured out so utilize that if you think that would be helpful, and you want to start doing more of this, but otherwise, yeah, I would love to connect and hang out on Instagram for sure.

Amazing. And all those links will be in the show notes including Megan's freebie that you can see. And definitely go check out her Instagram because she's got great viewpoints. And she'll show you just by like reading through her caption to see an really great model of how to like break out the headlines and the stories and the viewpoints on Instagram. 

Sara: Well, thank you so much, Megan, for joining us today. And thanks for tuning in to the launch playbook podcast. Thanks for tuning in to the launch playbook podcast. If you want to get weekly launch secrets in your ears. I hope you'll hit subscribe on iTunes you'll never miss an episode. Because who knows? It could reveal just the thing you've been looking for to make your next launch a success. And be sure to leave a five star review on iTunes telling me how this episode inspired your launch plans. Until next time, keep putting your big ideas out into the world. I'm rooting for you.

 

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